#17,#11 Dayne Beams
Moderator: bbmods
Firstly, I want to wish Beams all the best in his recovery.
While I accept that we are all smarter in hindsight, what was never part of any hindsight at the time of the trade, was that our two best midfielders ( Pendles and Sidey ) were much closer to the end than the beginning.
For me the trade wasn’t about Beams per say, it was more that the club would give up two first rounders and leave us with a mid field that comprises three 30 year olds in 2020 and no early picks for the next two drafts.
The lack of succession planning by the club was horrendous.
As has already been said, you don’t give up your two round picks, particularly when you’re the oldest team in the comp.
The response of “ oh but we still got Quaynor “ doesn’t wash either. Had we have not traded for Beams, we still would have got Quaynor and more ( particularly when they declared publicly we want to get into the first round of the 2019 draft )
To think Beams was likely to be the difference between a premiership or not is also drawing a long bow. Ask Gibbs, Franklin, Dangerfield, Ablett and co if they have made a difference to their second club winning the flag. ( obviously the Tigers did get it right with Lynch )
I posted the above arguments shortly after the Beams trade was completed and I maintained them ever since.
It was simply a short sighted, knee jerk reaction by the club. It’s not Beams fault at all and I say again, I wish him the best in his recovery.
I can only hope the club has a learned a lot from some of their recent player acquisitions, because if they haven’t, it’s going to be a long next decade or two.
While I accept that we are all smarter in hindsight, what was never part of any hindsight at the time of the trade, was that our two best midfielders ( Pendles and Sidey ) were much closer to the end than the beginning.
For me the trade wasn’t about Beams per say, it was more that the club would give up two first rounders and leave us with a mid field that comprises three 30 year olds in 2020 and no early picks for the next two drafts.
The lack of succession planning by the club was horrendous.
As has already been said, you don’t give up your two round picks, particularly when you’re the oldest team in the comp.
The response of “ oh but we still got Quaynor “ doesn’t wash either. Had we have not traded for Beams, we still would have got Quaynor and more ( particularly when they declared publicly we want to get into the first round of the 2019 draft )
To think Beams was likely to be the difference between a premiership or not is also drawing a long bow. Ask Gibbs, Franklin, Dangerfield, Ablett and co if they have made a difference to their second club winning the flag. ( obviously the Tigers did get it right with Lynch )
I posted the above arguments shortly after the Beams trade was completed and I maintained them ever since.
It was simply a short sighted, knee jerk reaction by the club. It’s not Beams fault at all and I say again, I wish him the best in his recovery.
I can only hope the club has a learned a lot from some of their recent player acquisitions, because if they haven’t, it’s going to be a long next decade or two.
Last edited by Pies2016 on Sat Dec 14, 2019 5:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Yep, the "we still got IQ" argument makes no sense at all. There are millions of trades the club could have made with any of 17 other clubs, all of them "still getting IQ". No one forced the club to do this one trade.Pies2016 wrote:...
The response of “ oh but we still got Quaynor “ doesn’t wash either. Had we have not traded for Beams, we still would have got Quaynor and more ( particularly when they declared publicly we want to get into the first round of the 2019 draft )
...
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melliot
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What my concerns are now, were my concerns at the time of the deal.Cam wrote:Hindsight is the the most accurate of all the sights. Beats foresight most of the time.
Beams was coming off an outstanding 2018 season. We salivated at the prospect of a goal-kicking midfielder being the extra link up in our chain.
The thing about mental illness is that it's not a fixed condition like a broken leg. It can come upon you rapidly, it can leave you temporarily. Like a bad habit it can leave you for a while, then return. You can appear fine to certain groups of people for long periods of time. It can be undetectable to all but the closest of your allies. Lying and deception can be huge parts of it. Self-deception vs resilience is a constant battle.
He might feel great and start training again in a week. I'm sure Collingwood will have some pretty handy doctors workig with him. Public admissions are part [it seems] of the AFL method of cleansing/rehab. We'll see.
From a Collingwood business point of view, the shareholders are angry, disappointed. But those shareholders are fickle. If he rehabilitates successfully and we can some return on investment... things get forgotten quickly if the results come.
Unfortunately though, his mental health has become as fragile as Benny Reid's physical health. Something we here have lost faith in.
Personally, I hope Beamsy regains faith in his own body and mind.
He was worth our first round pick. And that was it. He wasn't even a player type of need. Needed to chase a good kpp.
I wish the guy the best. But it was always a very risky recruit. Didn't need hindsight to know that. It's blown up in our face now. These decisions cost flags.
This worse than Mayne and Wells. They didn't cost us at the draft.
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warburton lad
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I wish Dayne Beams all the very best- mental health issues can be incredibly debilitating; I care about the club results on the field and not having Beams out there will be a negative, but I care more for a fellow traveller’s health and personal well-being than winning a footy match. His absence will create a spot for another young Magpie to step up into the breach.
Floreat Pica
Floreat Pica
Firm in the belief that number 17 flag is only months away...
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themonk
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You are correct, they didn’t cost us at the draft.melliot wrote:What my concerns are now, were my concerns at the time of the deal.Cam wrote:Hindsight is the the most accurate of all the sights. Beats foresight most of the time.
Beams was coming off an outstanding 2018 season. We salivated at the prospect of a goal-kicking midfielder being the extra link up in our chain.
The thing about mental illness is that it's not a fixed condition like a broken leg. It can come upon you rapidly, it can leave you temporarily. Like a bad habit it can leave you for a while, then return. You can appear fine to certain groups of people for long periods of time. It can be undetectable to all but the closest of your allies. Lying and deception can be huge parts of it. Self-deception vs resilience is a constant battle.
He might feel great and start training again in a week. I'm sure Collingwood will have some pretty handy doctors workig with him. Public admissions are part [it seems] of the AFL method of cleansing/rehab. We'll see.
From a Collingwood business point of view, the shareholders are angry, disappointed. But those shareholders are fickle. If he rehabilitates successfully and we can some return on investment... things get forgotten quickly if the results come.
Unfortunately though, his mental health has become as fragile as Benny Reid's physical health. Something we here have lost faith in.
Personally, I hope Beamsy regains faith in his own body and mind.
He was worth our first round pick. And that was it. He wasn't even a player type of need. Needed to chase a good kpp.
I wish the guy the best. But it was always a very risky recruit. Didn't need hindsight to know that. It's blown up in our face now. These decisions cost flags.
This worse than Mayne and Wells. They didn't cost us at the draft.
They did however eat into our salary cap & we couldn’t afford Lynch!
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WhyPhilWhy?
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Baz, I’m not 100% sure but I think the opportunity to add a top up player is “ only “ available if the player he is replacing, isn’t available to play at all in the 2020 season. If I’m correct, then the club would need to be convinced Beams won’t be back at all in 2020 before he could be replaced by someone else on the list.BazBoy wrote:Still curious if that Supplement player (added by March) would be invoked in our favour if a player goes on long term injury/illness
I ask cos I really don’t know the mechanics of it
Maybe someone here might
I’m happy to be corrected if others know better.
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Jezza
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Wish him well, but this has been a disastrous trade for the club. There's no other way to describe it.
While factoring in Beams' troubles, the club needs to look after its own interests as well and if that means cutting him loose then so be it.
The club cannot afford to be held hostage to a player who is on a big salary and faces an uncertain future. We have big names out of contract in 2020 and we're going to need to all the money we can to retain these players.
I got a sense very early on into last season that something wasn't right with Beams and I heard worrying rumours about off-field issues that haven't gone away. This was before he went on an indefinite break the first time round.
While factoring in Beams' troubles, the club needs to look after its own interests as well and if that means cutting him loose then so be it.
The club cannot afford to be held hostage to a player who is on a big salary and faces an uncertain future. We have big names out of contract in 2020 and we're going to need to all the money we can to retain these players.
I got a sense very early on into last season that something wasn't right with Beams and I heard worrying rumours about off-field issues that haven't gone away. This was before he went on an indefinite break the first time round.
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Rd10.1998_11.1#36
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I expect they were thinking it was a gamble that might have paid off with a flag. Obviously that didn’t happen but if it had I don’t think anyone would be saying it wasn’t worth it.K wrote:You have to wonder what the club was thinking.
For the record I also questioned if we really needed another 30yo mid but it’s done now.
As for not having the money to retain required players, it doesn’t cost any more if he’s not playing; possibly might cost less depending how his contract is structured. You would expect the club factored that in when recruiting him and during the recent trading periods.